(Internet for ESOL: Boon or Bandwagon?)
NETEACH Nook
------- ----
A spacious classroom with a comfortable, lived-in feeling to it. Someone has
put up at least one nice decoration: a world map with brightly colored push
pins showing where NETEACHers have connected from. So far, there are pins in
Japan, Korea, Hong Kong, Australia, Greece, UK, Brazil, Israel, Canada, France,
Germany, and all over the US.
You see Teacher's Desk, Big Table, Bulletin Board, Beanbags, Fireside
Bearskin, Kitchen Table, Wading Pool, and Hot Tub.
You see Claire, Chrissy [Guest], Gregor, Flemmex, Priscila, Frizzy,
Bronzed_Aussie, Orly, green [Guest], and ozzy [Guest] (Distracted) standing
about.
You see LCD Panel.
Obvious exits: out
Gregor [to Claire]: Ready to get started?
Claire says, "what a group! is it time to start, gregor? I'm Claire Bradin
from Michigan State U."
Gregor puts a transparency on the screen...
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Welcome to NETEACH-L's MOO discussion sessions!
(with much appreciation to schMOOze University
and its fine players, programmers, and wizards!)
Please note! Our sessions are always logged.
By participating, you give permission to Greg Younger to allow
access to the transcripts for research purposes at his discretion.
Before using any part of our logs for research or publication, please
obtain the permission of Greg Younger at youngerg@colorado.edu
For a transcript, please see our web page:
http://spot.colorado.edu/~youngerg/netmoo.html
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
You hear a fanfare of trumpets.
Gregor puts a transparency on the screen...
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
*** INTRODUCTIONS ***
You are of course welcome to remain anonymous, but at this time
we invite all of you who wish to do so to identify yourselves by
your name and affiliation.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Chrissy [Guest] says, "Chrissy is a research student in London, UK."
Claire says, "Claire Bradin from Michigan State University"
Flemmex says, "Mex Butler, CARWP and FLEMRW Melbourne"
Gregor is Greg Younger of Econ. Institute, Boulder, Colorado, USA/
Bronzed_Aussie [to Flemmex]: we have 5 networked computers since yeaterday ...
wonderful
Orly says, "Orly is a high school teacher from Israel "
Frizzy says, "Hi, I'm Frizzy (aka Karla Frizler), an Instructional Designer
for City College of San Francisco. My background is in ESL, but I now work
with teachers across the curriculum."
Bronzed_Aussie is a literacy teacher from AUstralia
ozzy [Guest] says, "Ozzy is a master student in Japan."
Priscila says, "I'm an MA student at Newcastle University"
green [Guest] says, "Greg Matheson from Sunchionhyang U in Korea"
Gregor says, "Great! Welcome! Glad you all could make it... looks like a great
turnout."
Frizzy . o O ( Try typing "Sunchionhyang" five times fast! )
green [Guest] says, "Yeh its's great to be here."
Bronzed_Aussie smirks
green [Guest] says, "Yeh, I got the spelling wrong actually."
Gregor says, "We had a fine discussion last week on the same topic, and itn
discussing it, Claire and I realized that we hadn't covered nearly all of
what could be discussed. Here's the topic:"
Frizzy giggles.
Gregor puts a transparency on the screen...
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
***Internet for ESOL: Boon or Bandwagon?***
What could be more fashionable than the Internet? Is there a danger that
the Internet is being embraced uncritically as language educators leap
onto the latest bandwagon? Its potential as a resource in second language
learning is widely hailed. However, serious technical, pedagogical, and
ethical issues present themselves. As trend-setters, tech coordinators
should be as well informed about the pitfalls of the Internet as they are
about its advantages.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Kyong [Guest] slides in, ready to NETwork.
ozzy [Guest] gathers its stuff and heads out the door.
Gregor hands the microphone to Claire and sits down, slurping coffee.
Bronzed_Aussie says, "good topic"
Frizzy applauds Clarire.
green [Guest] says, "Noisy fellow."
Frizzy [to green [Guest]]: "He has no manners."
Gregor wipes his chin.
Claire says, "what really surprised me last time was that people mentioned
that one of the major draawbacks to using the Internet was lack of access!
Which of course isn't an intrinsic drawback. What other disadvantages or
problems do you find in using the Internet with your students?"
Gregor says, "So leaving access issues out of the equation, what are other
technical and pedagogical problems?"
==================== BLACKBOARD ===========================
(Last week's ideas)
1) problems:
2) dead links!
3) slooooow download time
4) money for hardware
5) a million distractions more interesting than the poor teacher
6) staffing for network devt and maintenance
7) integration into the curriculum at large
8) thin or no content
9) few colleagues willing to collaborate.
10) teacher training in limited access situation
11) Unweildiness of developing appropriate curriculum for adult students
12) info overload for both students and teachers.
13) pages that dont show up properly in a particular browser
14) Account costs
15) advertisments that flash
16) limited lab hours or other lab usage restrictions.
17) missing helper applications (sound,movies) or wrong plug-ins
18) keeping up with all the developments
19) evil applets
20) fears about privacy
21) never, EVER having enough RAM
22) Making myself go to bed
23) net addiction!
24) sexual harassment
25) Getting the students to overcome their fears
26) getting the teachers to overcome THEIR fears!
27) Getting a phone line when you do outreach type delivery
28) paying for the phone line to demo the Internet at TESOL!
29) assuring the powers above that you will not let the students browse
'unclean' sites.
30) Timely access to things like scanners
31) figuring out activities for the students once they DO get access
===========================================================
green [Guest] "The students here aSunchomnhyang don't get email access.
Frizzy [to Claire]: "Actually, I think access is a HUGE issue. At our school,
students have access to a lab, but not networked classrooms. This really
changes the dynamic from using the Net as part of a class lesson to using it
as more of a supplement.
Flemmex says, "With some of them, lower level literacy, the intensity of the
text content scares them"
Priscila says, "training learners how to use programs and etc?"
Claire says, "yes, let's use the blackboard. (sorry, I've forgotten how to
page. :=)"
Gregor grins.
Gregor puts a transparency on the screen...
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Let's begin our discussion by just brainstorming some of the issues
we need to discuss today. We can use the BLACKBOARD, a feature of
this virtual classroom, to facilitate this process. To add a line of
text to the blackboard, anyone can type:
writeb
For example,
writeb Release time to go through training
To see what has been written, type:
look black (or just L black)
Feel free to toss some ideas up onto the blackboard now.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Gregor cleans the blackboard with a soapy sponge...
Claire says, "ah, training. do any of you worry that the time spent on
training may cut into time which should be spent on language learning? or can
these be combined?"
Gregor writes on the blackboard...
green [Guest] writes on the blackboard...
Frizzy writes on the blackboard...
Flemmex writes on the blackboard...
Priscila says, "Claire,, i believe it can be combined, but... depending on the
learenrs' level"
Gregor [to all]: Let's brainstorm some issues for a moment and then decide
which to come back to in depth.
Claire says, "with respect to "other-centeredness," could you be more explicit
in terms of how this relates to using the Internet?"
==================== BLACKBOARD ===========================
1) Danger of leading students into endless surfing with no results.. wasting
classtime.
2) other-centeredness
3) A big issue is training students who come into your ESL course without
computer experience. Not only are you teaching the content, but the
technology as well.
4) "Low level literacy students can be scared off by the amount of text they
have to handle, especially if they're doing a net search"
===========================================================
green [Guest] says, "Let's jsut brainstorm at the moment!?"
Frizzy reminds everyone to see the blackboard, type: look black
Bronzed_Aussie writes on the blackboard...
Gregor says, "Right, green... let's just put a bunch of ids quickly on the
blackboard (writeb ) and we'll come back to the issues which need
further exploration."
Gregor corrects a typo: ids = ideas
Flemmex nods at BA
Frizzy too.
green [Guest] writes on the blackboard...
Claire writes on the blackboard...
green [Guest] says, "communicating"
OK, you're not watching logins anymore.
Yao [Guest] slides in, ready to NETwork.
Gregor greet Yao. "Are you here for the NETEACH discussion?"
Flemmex wonders what excirttment is
==================== BLACKBOARD ===========================
1) Danger of leading students into endless surfing with no results.. wasting
classtime.
2) other-centeredness
3) A big issue is training students who come into your ESL course without
computer experience. Not only are you teaching the content, but the
technology as well.
4) "Low level literacy students can be scared off by the amount of text they
have to handle, especially if they're doing a net search"
5) relevance of IT to the lives of students out of the classroom
6) excirttement
7) Slowness of sound, graphics, and video files on the net
===========================================================
Yao [Guest] says, "Yes""
Frizzy welcomes Yao. "We're brainstorming possible drawbacks of using the Net
for teaching."
Gregor says, "Let me take a second to re-display the topic for those who came in
late..."
green [Guest] writes on the blackboard...
Flemmex writes on the blackboard...
Gregor puts a transparency on the screen...
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
***Internet for ESOL: Boon or Bandwagon***
What could be more fashionable than the Internet? Is there a danger that
the Internet is being embraced uncritically as language educators leap
onto the latest bandwagon? Its potential as a resource in second language
learning is widely hailed. However, serious technical, pedagogical, and
ethical issues present themselves. As trend-setters, tech coordinators
should be as well informed about the pitfalls of the Internet as they are
about its advantages.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
green [Guest] writes on the blackboard...
Flemmex writes on the blackboard...
Gregor [to Yao [Guest]]: Type LOOK BLACK to see the ideas we've written on the
blackboard so far...
Flemmex says, "Is excirttment more like excitement or excrement?"
green [Guest] writes on the blackboard...
green [Guest] says, "HaHaHaHa"
Gregor elbows Flemmex, grinning.
Priscila writes on the blackboard...
Flemmex says, "Nono I really want to know!!!"
Claire says, "Integrating material on the Internet into language learning
activities for the classroom or outside"
Claire writes on the blackboard...
jojo [Guest] slides in, ready to NETwork.
green [Guest] says, "Sorry, excirttement"
Gregor shoots green's typist.
green [Guest] says, "HaHaHa"
==================== BLACKBOARD ===========================
1) Danger of leading students into endless surfing with no results.. wasting
classtime.
2) other-centeredness
3) A big issue is training students who come into your ESL course without
computer experience. Not only are you teaching the content, but the
technology as well.
4) "Low level literacy students can be scared off by the amount of text they
have to handle, especially if they're doing a net search"
5) relevance of IT to the lives of students out of the classroom
6) excirttement
7) Slowness of sound, graphics, and video files on the net
8) writeb seeing the possibilities
9) difficulty in keeping up with all the apps and helpers you need to make a
session worthwhile for the ss
10) SPAM
11) Problems sharing computers with people who keep changing settings,
configs etc
12) not-nice people being given a forum
13) what concerns CMC,, it may not suite some learners style
14) Integrating material on the Internet into language learning activities
for the classroom or outside
===========================================================
green [Guest] says, "EXCITEMENT"
Gregor cheers.
jojo [Guest] says, "Jojo is here too!!""
Flemmex says, "Oh - but that's not a PORBLEM is it?"
green [Guest] writes on the blackboard...
Yao [Guest] says, "Yes, we know!""
Gregor says, "We've discussed the "balance of tech-language teaching time" issue a
couple times in this forum. It remains a big dilemma for a lot of teachers, I
think."
green [Guest] writes on the blackboard...
Frizzy says, "For those of you who are new, type LOOK BLACK to see what we've
been discussing so far."
Frizzy [to Gregor]: "I think it will continue to be an issue until
institutions commit to a computer literacy requirement. IMHO, students
should be introduced to word processing, e-mail, and basic computer
troubleshooting their first semester (college).
Gregor says, "I'm interested in #4: Low level literacy students can be scared off
by the amount of text. It's not just low level literacy students, IMO; it's a
lot of text for ANYONE..."
Flemmex says, "True"
Priscila says, "it is certainly a lot of text for me"
green [Guest] says, "so the envoironment has to be supportie"
Gregor says, "Is there any way to turn this drawback into an opportunity to
advance important skills?"
Claire says, "yes, the amount of text -- with sometimes too-difficult
vocabulary -- is a problem. And yet text is really what the web handles best
right now"
Frizzy says, "It's a catch-22. You want the students practicing reading &
writing, but I agree, it can be way too much."
Kyong [Guest] says, "I strong[D[D[D[D[D[D"absolutely, esp as a
non-native[D[D[D[D[D[D[D[Desp as NNs[DS fo[D[Dof English"
Flemmex says, "It's especialyy tricky for the low-levelled - unless they're
very excited about the whole thing"
Gregor [to Kyong [Guest]]: Try using your forward delete button instead of
backspace to erase...
green [Guest] says, "Give the students more control over how faxzt they have
to process it."
Claire says, "yes, but that excitement often soon turns to frustration."
Orly says, "My students just go from link to link without reading the texts :("
Flemmex says, "Yep it can"
Frizzy says, "One thing about MOO is that students are dealing with text in
order to communicate. They have motivation, and the "text" is not just text,
but someone talking to them."
green [Guest] says, "Yeh"
Flemmex says, "Put that on the board Orly"
Claire says, "what are some ways of giving students control over the speed of
processing the text?"
Flemmex says, "One computer each!!"
Frizzy [to Claire]: "Set them up on a slow computer with a 2400 modem. ;)
green [Guest] says, "Using email?"
Flemmex is using a 14400 this very moment
Gregor says, "I've noticed that my students are really ineffective at searching
for relevant docs on the web. *I* can usually decipher what I see in the
little "annotations" to decide whether to visit a site, but it seems really
opaque for them."
Claire says, "whoever wrote "seeing the possibilities -- do you mean seeing
them, not being able to take advantage of them, and being frustrated?"
Gregor says, "(using a search engine, that is)"
green [Guest] says, "It is a literacy issue. I am really slow at reading
Korean."
Flemmex says, "I found that for myself at the start Greg - went to heaps of
stupid places becasue I didn't know what the annotations were telling me"
green [Guest] says, "That's the downside of it."
Claire says, "how easy is it for second language students to use a search
engine (effectively!) in the target language?"
Frizzy nods to Gregor. "I really think it's important for teachers to guide
students to good sites at first, then give them guidelines for evaulating Web
sites, and let them roam free a bit.
Gregor turns to the literacy experts. "Can useful lessons be created to a)
deal with and b) exploit the amount of skimming necessary to use the web in a
worthwhile fasion?
green [Guest] says, "I meant being excited about something whixxh is going to
happen in the future!!"
Flemmex says, "Yeah Frizzy - and how much time it takes to do that well!!!"
Frizzy nods to Flemmex. "No kidding."
green [Guest] says, "So the yhave to have a goal."
Flemmex says, "It's fine if your mad and want to spend hour online looking
around, but for many people it's unreasonable amounts of time"
Torachan is going to try to join you.
Torachan has arrived.
Gregor greets Torachan.
Frizzy thinks the Web works best as a learning tool when students have
something specific they're looking for.
Torachan gives gregor a high 5
Flemmex corrects a typo: you're
green [Guest] says, "JUst like people grasagrade textbooks they have to start
grading sites."
Torachan says, "Hi everyone!"
Gregor grins at Torachan. "Type PEEK 3 on LCD to see what we're talking
about..."
Claire says, "to answer gregor: I think more has been done with target
languages other than English. There are now several good sites for low-level
language learners where students can practice vocabulary, skimming, etc."
green [Guest] says, "HIMr Tora"
Gregor [to Torachan]: And type LOOK BLACK to see what we've already said.
Flemmex says, "I inserviced some co-workers recently and thop we've had access
at work for over a year now, it was the first time some of them had ever used
the net"
[Torachan peeks into No.3.]
Flemmex grins at Torachan like a Cheshire cat.
Flemmex says, "Sorry"
Claire says, "for example, for German, Spanish, and French. A fantastic site
for Chinese is in preparation."
jojo [Guest] says, "Can a few well designed "Should we select a few well
designed sites & get L2 ss to stick to tjose woops those first?""
Gregor groans, nodding at Flemmex. "I often feel my workshops are a waste of
time since I never see teachers in the lab again outside my workshop."
Bronzed_Aussie [to Gregor]: my students have just started a project involving
them organising a holiday --- they used the WWW today to compare airline
prices to various destinations --- It was a purposeful skimming device linked
to classroom work involving numeracy
Torachan Grins back at Flemmex
Bronzed_Aussie says, "there was a very definite objective"
Gregor nods about the importance of objectives.
Frizzy [to Flemmex]: "At our school, all faculty and staff have access to
e-mail, but only half have even requested accounts (probably half of them
have never logged on). But our students can't get accounts unless requested
by a teacher (and they only last for a semester!), but they WANT the access.
Go figure.
Torachan says, "I do think that one needs to think long and hard about what it
is that one want's one's students to learn. "
Gregor [to jojo [Guest]]: I think that's a good point. "Surfing" is not a good
assignment.
green [Guest] says, "People get headaches in libraries too when they read too
much."
Frizzy agrees with Torachan. "That's just good teaching, whether the Net is
involved or not. :)"
Torachan says, "I like the objectives comment too"
Flemmex says, "We did one like that yesterday BA - we were doing road accident
stats in numeracy and a couple went off and accessed the VicRoads site and
brought back info - all quite casually and stuff. I was delighted"
Bronzed_Aussie [to Flemmex]: sounds good!
jojo [Guest] says, "A few well chosen sites can be used for all lvele woops
levels and a huge range of activities..""
Gregor says, "Claire compared making a webpage of links for one's students to
making ahandout for them. It directs where they go on the web so that they
can make worthwhile use of their time."
Frizzy agrees.
Ana is going to try to join you.
Ana has arrived.
Torachan says, "I must admit that I'm moving away from language teaching
towards teaching media skills/vis a vis the internet ect..."
green [Guest] says, "Becaause there is a lot of anarchy on the Net, people are
goiing to get frustrated more oftern if there is no guidance."
Frizzy says, "It's nice to know your students have *somewhere* to go where
they can find quality sites."
Torachan smiles at Ana
Gregor welcomes Ana. "Hi! Type PEEK 3 ON LCD to see what we're talking about."
Frizzy [to Torachan]: "Me too. It's how I got a f/t job."
Flemmex nods at Ana.
Ana says, "OK."
Gregor [to Torachan]: To teachers or to EFL students?
Torachan [to Frizzy]: I just got a slick new job!
Torachan [to Gregor]: Both
Claire says, "I get really tired of hearing people -- many of them teachers
--say that there is no worthwhile content on the Internet. If there isn't,
who should we blame but ourselves? As educators we have the responsibillity
to PROVIDE the content -- just as we do if we don't like the textbooks!"
Gregor says, "Cool... my ideal job. I love teacher training AND language teaching."
green [Guest] says, "I gotta go home and brush nmy teeth. See you next time."
jojo [Guest] says, "how many hrs a day is min for a competant EFL teacher
using the WWW""
green [Guest] has disconnected.
A campus caretaker arrives, and escorts green [Guest] to bed.
Bronzed_Aussie says, "but what I wonder everyone is to what extent students
will need these IT skills in their lives outside the classroom? "
Gregor [to Bronzed_Aussie]: Depends on the students. Mine certainly will.
Torachan says, "to Bronz There's the million dollar question!"
Claire says, "most people seem to write textbooks because they aren't
satisfied with what is available. By the same token, we have to upgrade what
is on the net if we don't like it."
Torachan blushes
Gregor [to jojo [Guest]]: You mean to learn? Or as a result of internet
addiction (like some people in this room!) :o)
Flemmex says, "It's impossible to really tell that at this stage - who knows
how far and fast it's going to move ahead?"
Yao [Guest] has disconnected.
A campus caretaker arrives, and escorts Yao [Guest] to bed.
Flemmex looks around to see who Greg could possibly be referring to
Torachan says, "I do think that there is a need to re-evaluate all education,
and that teaching IT skills is a start in that direction"
jojo [Guest] says, "I agree with "tongue in cheek - many hrs""
[Ana peeks into No.3.]
Frizzy [to Bronzed_Aussie]: "I think all students will need some amount of
computer literacy to function in the next century. Look at things like
online banking, for example. That could be how all banks function in another
5, 10, 20 years.
Kyong [Guest] has disconnected.
A campus caretaker arrives, and escorts Kyong [Guest] to bed.
Gregor says, "Any job in business will probably require email skills. Anyone
pursuing higher education will probably be expected to do research via the
net."
Flemmex nods at Frizzy.
Frizzy [to Torachan]: "What is your hot new job?"
Ana says, "I agree it's time to reevaluate the way teachers are being trained
at the university."
Flemmex [to Gregor]: Are already it seem sto me
==================== BLACKBOARD ===========================
1) Danger of leading students into endless surfing with no results.. wasting
classtime.
2) other-centeredness
3) A big issue is training students who come into your ESL course without
computer experience. Not only are you teaching the content, but the
technology as well.
4) "Low level literacy students can be scared off by the amount of text they
have to handle, especially if they're doing a net search"
5) relevance of IT to the lives of students out of the classroom
6) excirttement
7) Slowness of sound, graphics, and video files on the net
8) writeb seeing the possibilities
9) difficulty in keeping up with all the apps and helpers you need to make a
session worthwhile for the ss
10) SPAM
11) Problems sharing computers with people who keep changing settings,
configs etc
12) not-nice people being given a forum
13) what concerns CMC,, it may not suite some learners style
14) Integrating material on the Internet into language learning activities
for the classroom or outside
15) ecxcitenment
16) the dependence on systems over which we have little control
===========================================================
Torachan says, "I wonder what the end goal of education is... For me, it's
the production of auto-didactic (self-teaching) people.. "
jojo [Guest] says, "T's are not being trained - they are training themselves
mostly""
Ana says, "I agree. We have to prepare students to learn in spite of teachers."
Bronzed_Aussie [to Frizzy]: true. I have invited the Commonwealth Bank of
Australia's IT man to come out and tell us all about electronic banking next
week. They are all excited about it --- dunno why though, they have no money,
no computers and some of them, no phone!
Dasha is going to try to join you.
Dasha has arrived.
Flemmex laughs at Ana's comment
Dasha says, "Hi, sorry to come at the end"
Flemmex says, "Hi Dasha! :)"
Claire says, "hi dash"
Ana says, "Hi!"
Gregor [to jojo [Guest]]: That's very true. At TESOL this spring, I asked all
the members of the CALL-Interest Section Steering committee if they'd had
formal training in computers. Less than half had ever taken a computer class.
[Chrissy [Guest] peeks into No.3.]
Frizzy has to get going. "Nice to see y'all again!"
Torachan [to Frizzy]: I'll be running the network for Doshisha HS in Kyoto, as
well as teaching media skills and whatever else is needed. They just built
an amazing new center...
Flemmex laughs at BA's comment
Gregor says, "Hiya, Dasha!"
Frizzy waves.
Torachan says, "Hi Dasha!"
Ana says, "The problem is not only the lack of training in using computers..."
Flemmex waves at Frizzy.
Claire says, "bye Friz"
Gregor says, "Bye, Frizzy!"
The cosmic goddess places Frizzy upon a cloud with a silver lining and wooshes
her back to real life.
Frizzy has disconnected.
Dasha [to Frizzy]: hi and bye
Ana says, "i train teachers who have no idea of what to select to teach from a
book!"
jojo [Guest] has disconnected.
A campus caretaker arrives, and escorts jojo [Guest] to bed.
Flemmex says, "Yes Ana?"
Ana says, "I don't know if this is a problem in my country only. "
Flemmex nods at Ana
Gregor [to Claire]: Did we mention everything you thought we would mention
here today?
Flemmex says, "Sometimes I feel like *I* don't know what I should be selecting"
Claire says, "if the teachers don't know how to select material from a book
and turn it into a lesson or classroom activity, I don't know how they can be
expected to do it on the Internet"
Claire says, "no, not everything, but some things"
Ana says, "Right! It's even more difficult!"
Torachan says, "I still think it's a philisophical problem..."
Gregor [to Claire]: Any hot topics you;d like to quickly list?
Flemmex says, "When you get to the specifics of choosing material tailored to
fit an untailorable group...."
Ana says, "And these teachers have been to good(?) universities."
Dasha [to Claire]: Has this disscussion been much like last week's?
Claire says, "All of us wonder about what we should be selecting from ANY
source! If we don't worry about it, then we should probably be replaced. :-)"
Dasha says, "Oh, swell. Lag."
Flemmex [to Dasha]: No - we skipped the stuff about access
Dasha nods.
Claire says, "I'd be interested in hearing people's comments about their
experiences in having language leaners use audio, graphics, and video on the
web"
Flemmex nods at Claire.
Gregor nods Ana. "I've learned a lot more from teaching with intelligent
colleagues than I could have possibly learned from my pretty rigorous masters
program."
Bronzed_Aussie says, "and of course, EFL teaching is so different to ESL ---
the needs and interests of the rich as opposed to the needs and interests of
the poor . Net teaching caters to the former mostly"
Ana says, "I think the problem is notthe Net. It's teacher's education."
Flemmex says, "Greg? More?"
Torachan nods to Ana!
Ana nods at Gregor.
Gregor [to Claire]: I have been reticent to try anything with audio on the net.
Gregor [to Flemmex]: More what?
Claire says, "why, reticent gregor?"
Flemmex [to Gregor]: Your comment about learning more from teaching with
intelligent colleagues
Ana says, "Today I'll be in a round table about the pros and cons about the
net. With dave Sperling."
Bronzed_Aussie [to Ana]: I was about to mention THAT site!
Claire says, "Have any of you tried doing listening comprehension on the web?
with audio files?"
Gregor [to Claire]: Lack of tech support here for getting plugins loaded on
all the machines in the lab, for one thing,.
Ana says, "I have."
Claire says, "where is the round table, Ana, online somewhere?"
Gregor [to Ana]: When is that roundtable?
Ana says, "Today."
Gregor says, "Yes....? :o)"
Bronzed_Aussie [to Ana]: when?
Claire says, "could you be more specific?!?"
Gregor giggles at Ana.
Ana says, "It's in a Laurels conference. Sao Paulo, Brazil."
Dasha says, "I've toyed with CUSeeMe, but it wasn't satisfactory..."
Flemmex laughs at the info vultures
Ana says, "It's a presencial meeting, sorry."
Gregor says, "Oh, you mean a LIVE roundtable! We all assumed you meant online!"
Gregor cracks up!
Torachan giggles
Claire says, "where is it anyway? I'm interested"
Bronzed_Aussie says, "Dave Sperling is doing a Paulo Friere --- taking the Net
to the poor of Brazil :)?"
Claire says, "what is a Laurel's conference?"
Ana says, "Sorry. Dave is in Brazil for a series of conferences and I was
invited to discuss the Net with him and some other people."
Priscila says, "Latin american union of recognized english language schools"
Claire says, "cool. "
Priscila says, "LAURELS"
Ana says, "Laurels is a group of English schools worldwide..."
Ana says, "Right!"
Priscila says, "nope, only in latin american"
Gregor notes the time. "I need to go teach in a few minutes... any last
comments to get into the log?
Priscila says, "i'm a LAURELS teacher back in brazil ;)"
Flemmex says, "Go Pris!"
Ana [to Priscila]: Great!
Claire says, "None of us are ready to give up on the Internet regardless of
how frustrating it is!"
Flemmex laughs aloud.
Bronzed_Aussie says, "that's the thing --- so much of it is pitched at the
high end of the market --- I bet my bottom dollar there is no one in Brazil
truly interested in providing access to language learners from poorer socio
economic backgrounds -- that's where so much more is happening here in
australia "
Utvols is going to try to join you.
Ana [to Claire]: Here, here!
Flemmex says, "How else is it going to change?"
Utvols has arrived.
Gregor says, "Oh! Quick advert: If you're interested in doing an easy 20-minute
presentation of how you use the net in your ESOL teaching at the TESOL
convention in Seattle next march, get in touch with me!"
Ana says, "Can I have a log of this session?"
Utvols finds a good standing spot at the back of the room.
Claire says, "Bronzed_Aussie, upon what do you base your opinion of what is
going on in Brazil?"
Flemmex says, "I wish!"
Gregor [to Ana]: It will be posted to the website....
Claire says, "hi Utvols"
Utvols says, "hi Claire"
Gregor puts a transparency on the screen...
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****** Thanks for participating! ******
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Ana [to Bronzed_Aussie]: You're mistaken...
Bronzed_Aussie [to Ana]: tell me more
Gregor says, "Hi, Utvols."
Chrissy [Guest] says, "Bye, everyone. Nice to be here as a lurker. "
Gregor [to Chrissy [Guest]]: Thanks for coming!
Flemmex says, "Bye Claire!"
Claire says, "bye"
Torachan waves.
Ana says, "Bye!"
Gregor says, "Thanks for coming everyone!"
Gregor says, "And a big round of applause for Claire, for leading this session!"
Gregor cheers.
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