Talking to Lesley about Talking to Strangers

NETEACH Nook
------- ----
A spacious classroom with a comfortable, lived-in feeling to it. In
addition to all the decorations brought by teachers from all parts
of the globe, there is a large, up-to-date world map with brightly
colored push-pins showing where NETEACHers have connected from. So
far, there are pins in Japan, Korea, Hong Kong, Australia, Greece,
UK, Brazil, Israel, Canada, France, Germany, Kuwait, Cyprus, Taiwan,
and all over the US.
You see Teacher's Desk, Big Table, Bulletin Board, Beanbags, Fireside Bearskin, Kitchen Table, Wading Pool, and Hot Tub.
You see Gregor, Godzilla, KeikoS, Miao, Venny, Colega, and Lesley standing about.
You see LCD Panel.
Obvious exits: out

Lesley says, "I'm suggesting using encore because I may need to share web pages and it's easier to do it that way."
Colega woud be happy to do that.
Colega picks an l up off the floor and sticks it in "would"
Lesley says, "I'm down to around 5 seconds now, so maybe we could begin?"
Gregor nods.

Gregor puts Transparency No.1 on the stage.

On the screen you see...
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             Welcome to NETEACH-L's MOO discussion sessions!

             (with much appreciation to schMOOze University
             and its fine players, programmers, and wizards!)

               Please note! Our sessions are always logged.
      By participating, you give permission to Greg Younger to allow
    access to the transcripts for research purposes at his discretion.
    Before using any part of our logs for research or publication, please
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                For a transcript, please see our web page:
                    http://www.dyvic.com/~greg/netmoo/

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KeikoS nods- fine with me.

Gregor puts Transparency No.2 on the stage.

On the screen you see...
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                      ***      INTRODUCTIONS      ***

     You are of course welcome to remain anonymous, but at this time
     we invite all of you who wish to do so to identify yourselves by
     your name and affiliation.
 

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Colega is Lonnie Turbee soon-to-be-Chu, Director of Educational Environment Development at Dyvic Innovations, Inc.  ... and a long-time MOOer.
Lesley is Lesley Shield from the Open University in the United Kingdom
Gregor is Greg Younger, Director of Instructional Systems Integration at Dyvic Innovations.
Godzilla is Larry Davies, Future University - Hakodate, Japan.
Gregor things TurbeeChu sounds like a Pokemon creature. ;o)
Gregor ducks!
KeikoS is Keiko Schneider from Albuquerque, New Mexico.  So far does Web design and consulting hoping to get back teaching soon.
Colega grins.
Jack is going to try to join you.

Gregor puts Transparency No.3 on the stage.

On the screen you see...
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      *** Talking to Lesley about Talking to Strangers  ***

Shield (that's our Lesley!), Hauck, and Hewer, all of Open University,
describe three pilot studies in which distance students in the Centre
for Modern Language courses and their instructors communicated via
different voice applications in addition to email. As you read in the
paper, they ended up with a typology of tutor roles and activities for
online instruction focusing on fluency as opposed to accuracy.

Let's grill and drill Lesley with the questions raised by the paper and by
our own experiences communicating and teaching our students in online
settings. The paper is available at:

http://hennepin.open.ac.uk/fels-staff/lesley-shield/webbed/untele/shieldhauckhewer/talkingtostrangers.html

(Wow, that's a long URL! If you bring up the paper on your screen, don't forget
to come back to your schMOOze window for the discussion!)

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Jack has arrived.
Lesley says, "Well, why don't we just share that url for those using enCore?"
Jack feels sorry to show up impolitely
Gregor [to Lesley]: Go for it.
Miao is Jenyi Wu, a grad student in second language education in OISE/UT.
Lesley shares a URL...
  <http://hennepin.open.ac.uk/fels-staff/lesley-shield/webbed/untele/shieldhauckhewer/talkingtostrangers.html>.
Gregor [to Jack]: No problem; you're welcome to join our discussion.
Lesley says, "Ok, how many people are running encore now?"
Godzilla raises a fin.
Venny'd better go to bed now, and will join the B session latter.
Venny goes home.
Lesley would like to tell everyone now that she, like Greg, is logging this session.
Lesley [to Gregor]: Would you like to explain how we'd like this discussion to run, or should I?
Gregor [to Lesley]: I'm going to stay logged in with Pueblo for logging purposes, but I'll log in as Grumpy in another window using encore now.
Gregor [to Lesley]: You go ahead, that's fine.
Miao says, "No prob."
Grumpy is going to try to join you.
Lesley says, "I'm logging using encore, so we can check which is easier now."
Grumpy has arrived.
Grumpy waves grumpily.
Lesley says, "Ok, what I'd like to do is *not* to 'give a lecture'!"
KeikoS says, "Oh, so that is enCore for SchMOOze, I just went to as Guest Keiko?"
Grumpy cheers grumpily. "Thank god for that!"
Lesley says, "What I would much prefer is for those of you who've read the paper Greg suggested to ask questions and we'll get a discussion running from that."
Lesley [to KeikoS]: No, you're in Vousi MOO as guest keiko.
KeikoS thanks Lesley for clarification
Grumpy [to KeikoS]: go to the schMOOze homepage and click the encore client link.. you can log in with your KeikoS character here.
Lesley nods at KeikoS.
Jack bows to you
KeikoS bows to Grumpy, thanks.
Lesley notes that most of the people here today for this discussion probably already know a lot about the work she's been involved in over the last couple of years.
KeikoS bows back to Jack.
Gregor says, "Lesley, my first question is about the balance of goals... in your paper, you talk about developing fluency as opposed to accuracy. But is accuracy also a goal of the courses?"
Lesley says, "Ok, an interesting question."
Gregor says, "And could you give a brief description on how accuracy get attended to in the courses?"
Lesley says, "Let me a) try to answer this myself and b) quote from something else that I've written with a colleague (being a self-publicist!)"
Gregor says, "I know that's not the focus of this discussion, but it needs to be addressed too, I think"
Lesley says, "Ok.  Perhaps I should begin by explaining what we've been working on for the last 3 years or so."
Lesley says, "What we're talking about today is the use of audio- (voice over internet) and audiographics to support the development of fluency in the target language for distance learners."
Colega listens attentively.
Miao nods.
Lesley says, "The context is that we have between 6-8000 learners of French, German and Spanish (lower to upper intermediate, roughly)."
Lesley says, "They are all distance learners."
KeikoS is all ears
Lesley says, "This means that they work on all materials in their own home, at a distance fromeach other and from their tutors."
Lesley says, "In terms of face-to-face contact, they get up to 21 hours a year."
Lesley says, "That is at day schools, at weekends and maybe in the evening."
Lesley says, "Second level courses have a compulsory one week residential component too."
Lesley says, "However, as you see, this is not a large amount of time in which they can practise speaking and listening."
Lesley says, "Although they get a lot of listening practise from audio and videotapes"
Lesley says, "So, to answer Greg's question - yes there is accuracy development, and that takes place mainly in the 'traditional' materials."
Lesley says, "What we lacked was speaking practice.  So this is why we moved first into telephone conferencing and then into audio-/audiographics."
Gregor nods. "That's what I figured, Lesley; I just wanted to see where that piece fits."
Lesley draws a breath and wonders if that a) contextualises and b) answers the question (which she's now forgotten it was so long ago).
Lesley shuts up
Gregor [to Lesley]: Perfect. :o)
Lesley waits for questions/discussion
Lesley adds that Godzilla has seen the audiographics tool in its early version.
Colega [to Lesley]: Do you find that the voice-over-Internet technology is really adequate for FL learning?
Lesley [to Colega]: Yes.
Lesley will show you some student feedback... please ask questions or talk while waiting for me to find the url.
Colega [to Lesley]: How do they handle the usual disruptions, echoes, fuzziness etc?
Colega would love to see student feedback.
KeikoS is embarassed, could somebody enlighten me with audiographics and what they do?
Gregor says, "I tried out HearMe and it worked great, with headphones to prevent lag causing echoes."
Lesley [to KeikoS]: Yes, I'll explain that first, if Colega doesn't mind.
Godzilla [to Colega]: If this is improved from what I saw (HEARD!) in Kyoto in 1999, then it is probably VERY clear and uniterrupted.
Gregor says, "Unfortunately, the entire HearMe site seems to have been taken over by lonely sexual deviants, but whatcha gonna do. :o)"
Colega nods.
Colega was nodding to LESLEY, not Gregor!
KeikoS sighs, too bad.
Lesley says, "Audiographics is when you have (in our case) an integrated voice over internet client with shared graphics tools like a whiteboard, a concept map and a screen grab possibility.  We also run a text chat client."
Gregor laughs.
Lesley says, "I'll show you a screen shot - or at least for those of you who are using enCore."
Colega would like URLs for the very best VOI sites.
Lesley shares a URL...
  <http://hennepin.open.ac.uk/fels-staff/lesley-shield/webbed/untele/lamyshield/Fig1cMNLLS.jpg>.
Colega swoons at the beauty of Lesley's definition.
Godzilla nods in agreement with Colega to see those URLs.
Lesley [to Colega]: They're only as good as you make them - voi sites, that is.
Lesley says, "Firetalk, Paltalk are two of the major ones."
Lesley says, "hearme is no more."
Lesley says, "Oh dear, we have a lag to the site I'm trying to show you."
Gregor nods re the demise of HearMe. "I'd read that."
Lesley shares a URL...
  <http://hennepin.open.ac.uk/fels-staff/lesley-shield/webbed/untele/lamyshield/Fig1cMNLLS.jpg>.
Lesley tries again
Gregor [to Lesley]: It popped right up for me... no problem here.
Lesley says, "Oh good.  Can anyone else see a picture with French on it?"
Lesley says, "If so, I'll explain what bit is what."
Godzilla says, "I can see the first picture, but the second has not loaded yet."
Lesley says, "The bit on the left is the speech window.  In it, you can see the names of everyone in the same room as yourself."
Lesley says, "When they speak, a hand appears by their name so you can match voice to name."
KeikoS got the jpg
Lesley says, "If they want to interrupt, it's full duplex, which means more than one speaker can talk at one time, though that can be confusing as it would be in f2f conversation."
Lesley says, "So, we've found that students have developed a protocol whereby the click on the 'talk' button to make the hand flash to demonstrate they want to speak.  in fact,they did this so much, that there's now a 'hands up' button they can use for this purpose."
Colega grins
Gregor says, "In the conference calls Colega and I do with our home office, we've discovered how important it is to be able to interrupt, even if it does cause confusion that needs to be repaired."
Lesley says, "On the right of the screen, you see the whiteboard.  This is object oriented and allows students (and tutors) to draw on it, write on it, generally make a mess of it."
Lesley nods at Gregor.
Lesley says, "I do agree."
Lesley will look for that feedback while Greg elucidates more.
Gregor elucidates....
Colega says, "People need to see that you're about to interrupt. IRL you make gestures to indicate that, but with voice only, it's very hard to get a word in edgewise."
Lesley translates something that a student fedback in French while Greg does that...
Gregor says, "The home office has a conference calling phone that automatically stops incoming audio when someone there is speaking. So if the folks in the home office don't stop to take a breath, they can't hear us trying to get a word in. They don't know we're trying to talk at all."
Colega says, "In-MOO everyone can interrupt and, as long as you can follow the choppy flow, everyone gets heard, whether it's their text-based voice or their text-based gestures."
KeikoS nods, all valid points
Colega says, "So if you don't have a graphic that shows "I want to interject here" you at least have to have text chat available.  "
Gregor says, "So that's a really key feature."
Colega thinks this may be one of the difficulties of straight telephone that makes telephoning in a foreign language so terrifying.
Gregor says, "And i'm interested in lesley's mention of the confusion that interruption causes. I imagine that it offers an opportunity for conversational repair that you wouldn't get in any other medium."
Lesley says, "Yes, but interestingly, where text chat is available, the repair may happen there rather than in the audio channel!  We're investigating that."
Gregor says, "Wow, that's fascinating!"
Lesley says, "Ah, here's some of the feedback..."
Colega says, "Perhaps because you're *sure* you'll be "heard" in text chat.  Everyone can definitely see your repair, whereas in audio you're never positive if what you said was caught."
"-0-0-0-0-Lesley gets out a quill pen-0-0-0-0-"
The most important aspect was being able to talk to each other without having to travel to a study centre and without being encumbered by a telephone. Although we could not see each other this did not seem to matter...
"-0-0-0-0-Lesley admires her flawless copperplate handwriting-0-0-0-0-"
Gregor [to Colega]: And the repair doesn't interrupt the flow of the "real" conversation if you switch media.
Lesley says, "And going back to Greg's question re fluency..."
Colega grins at Gregor.
"-0-0-0-0-Lesley gets out a quill pen-0-0-0-0-"
I was amazed how much I could keep going off the cuff so to speak when I felt other members of the group were expecting my input
"-0-0-0-0-Lesley admires her flawless copperplate handwriting-0-0-0-0-"
Colega [to Lesley]: What's the difference between being "encumbered" by a telephone and being encumbered by VOI?
Lesley waits for more questions?
Colega says, "YESS! My own students using MOO years ago said that knowing someone was waiting for a response meant they didn't have time to think in L1 - it pleasantly forced them to stay in L2 and *then* they experienced fluency, even "flow.""
Gregor says, "Colega's question reminds me of a similar one I had..."
Colega . o O ( communication in a FL as transcendent experience.... )
Lesley [to Colega]: With telephone, you have something you have to hold.  With a computer, you can wander off and do something else or look at other things.  In other words you can move about.
Gregor says, "In the paper under the heading "From Fixed Time to Flexible Syncronous Meetings...""
Colega is lagging badly.
Lesley says, "Oh, yes, sorry, that's the other thing."
Colega nods to Lesley as she answers her email.  ;-)
Gregor says, "It says "Internet based tech is available 24/7" in contrast to telephoning. Ummm... my telephone is available 24/7. I don't get this point."
Puzzled is going to try to join you.
Colega giggles.
Puzzled has arrived.
Lesley says, "telephone conferences are fixed time while voice over internet is 24/7 and students can connect to meet each other without the tutor being present."
Gregor's jaw drops. "Puzz! Long time no see!"
Lesley says, "telephone conferences, in other words, have to be organised in advance."
Lesley says, "And they are very expensive compared to 24/7 technology."
Colega says, "And students *do* keep hours that many tutors/teachers wouldn't dream of!"
Gregor [to Lesley]: Ah, to avoid long distance charges, you mean.
Gregor says, "Got it."
Colega waves to Puzzled.
Lesley [to Gregor]: Indeed they do.
Lesley says, "No, to avoid conference call charges, which are very high in many parts of the world."
Puzzled waves to all 'n sundy
Lesley says, "And you don't actually *have* to organise a voice over internet conference in advance - you can just 'drop in' to see if anyone's there to chat with."
Lesley nods at Puzzled.
Gregor [to Lesley]: But the human scheduling is the same either way... synchronous is synchronous. Tutors and students have to make arrangements to get together, whenever it is.
Colega [to Lesley]: Yes, that works in an environment that has enough population so that you do find people there at all hours.
Jack waves at puzzled
Lesley [to Colega]: It does.  But when there's a low population, students can make informal arrangements to meet in advance if they want to.  And, unlike a telephone call, it's cheap enough not to matter if the other(s) don't turn up.
Lesley [to Gregor]: Voice over internet gives students the freedom to meet when *they* want between scheduled sessions.
Gregor says, "You get a "place" to meet and drop by in VLE's that doesn't exist on the telephone."
Lesley says, "Telephone conferences don't allow that freedom."
Gregor nods to Lesley.
Jack says, "sorry guys....my mom is yelling at me...glad to attend here......see ya :)"
Jack waves at you
Gregor waves to Jack and his mom.
Lesley says, "Well, Greg, you do, but I think there's less of a sense of 'place' in an audio channel than here, for example.  This is partly why we added the graphical element.  It's very easy to lose concentration if you're *only* speaking/listening."
Grumpy wonders if Jack's mom is yelling at him about trading the cow for those stupid beans.
Gregor thwaps Grumpy with a rolled-up newspaper. "BAD! BAD! BAD!"
Jack has disconnected.
Colega says, "So what if you had an environment, like MOO, where you could have both "place" and VOI?"
Lesley says, "Ah, here's an explanation of the differences which may be clearer:"
"-0-0-0-0-Lesley gets out a quill pen-0-0-0-0-"
Telephone conferences have to be arranged in advance and can be costly to run. With the increased robustness of Internet audio
                         technology, it has now become possible to offer learners in a virtual online learning environment more flexibility (in terms of time, frequency and group composition) than does a telephone conference.
"-0-0-0-0-Lesley admires her flawless copperplate handwriting-0-0-0-0-"
Miao wonders,too.
Gregor [to Lesley]: I wonder what the effect of adding some "environmental" elements to the look and feel of the software would have. Make the background look like a room or someting.
Lesley [to Colega]: Such things do exist
Colega says, "...except that MOO doesn't have VOI..."
Lesley says, "It isn't hard to add voice to MOO - it's just that it's no longer really MOO then."
Colega [to Lesley]: Got a URL on one?
Lesley [to Gregor]: That would very much depend on the activity one was doing, wouldn't it?
Lesley [to Colega]: Well, how about ActiveWorlds, for example?  I know it's graphical, but it has all the things we're talking about.
Gregor [to Lesley]: Different "rooms" for different purposes.
Lesley [to Gregor]: Well, we use many different rooms.
Lesley will show you the concept map, to demonstrate other tools are available.  A moment please.
Gregor [to Lesley]: But I get the sense from you that these "rooms" don't offer much of a sense of place.
Gregor says, "WebCT offers each course 4 chat "rooms," but there's nothing roomlike about it. It's just a plain old java chat window in each case."
The housekeeper arrives to cart Jack off to bed.
Lesley shares a URL...
  <http://hennepin.open.ac.uk/fels-staff/lesley-shield/webbed/networkedlearning2000/NL2000pic2.jpg>.
Lesley says, "Room is merely a useful concept or metaphor if you like."
Lesley says, "And there actually *is* a sense of place - students frequently use verbs such as 'meet' and 'see' when talking to each other/about the environment."
Gregor squints
Lesley says, "For example, this from a student: "opportunity to meet other students while removing the rush/stress of trying to get to tutorials.""
Colega [to Lesley]: In-MOO you have rooms connected to rooms connected to streets and byways and public areas... going on for thousands of "places"...
Colega says, "Like in real life."
Lesley [to Colega]: Yes, but MOO serves a different purpose.  'Room' *is* nevertheless a useful 'virtual' concept.
Lesley says, "ActiveWorlds and the Palace do the same thing graphically, but I'd argue that they don't have a sense of place."
Lesley says, "Once you use graphics like that, you lose the freedom afforded by text and the imagination."
Gregor says, "I get more of a sense of place in AW than in Palace."
Lesley says, "Like the difference between radio and tv, for example."
KeikoS wonders what does give sensei of place, then?
Lesley says, "I get no sense of place from any of the graphical MOOs."
Gregor says, "I think the cheesy avatar graphics in Palace actually work against getting a sense that YOU are in place with other people."
Colega [to Lesley]: Imagination???  Did you say the I word?   I suppose next you'll be talking about creativity!
Lesley washes her mouth out!
Colega grins.
KeikoS says, "sense of..."
Lesley [to Colega]: Oops, I do apologise!
Colega chuckles.
Gregor [to KeikoS]: I find that Japanese teachers give a sensei of place. :o)
Lesley [to Gregor]: I feel the same about AW's graphics.
Lesley pokes at Gregor.
KeikoS grins to Gregor and apologize the typo
Lesley wonders if everyone else ahs gone to sleep?
Gregor [to KeikoS]: Never apologize for a typo that causes amusement! :o)(
Lesley corrects a typo:  ahs ==> has
Colega [to Lesley]: They're checking their email.  ;-)
Lesley snorts.
Miao [to Lesley]: But the few kids I worked with in Graphic MOO like those gifs thy put in thier rooms and objects.
Lesley [to Miao]: So they may, but what is the *purpose* of doing that?
Gregor [to Lesley]: Maybe it's a matter of what you get accustomed to. I've played enough 1st person and 3rd person video games that that animated 3d environment feels like a place to me.
Lesley [to Gregor]: I've played those too, and those feel more 'real' to me than 'aw'...
Gregor nods to Lesley.
Lesley says, "I just find the way of moving around aw particularly annoying."
Miao [to Lesley]: To strengthen the visual sense of the object in VL.
Gregor nods again. "I'm not touting it; I think that avatars are pretty distracting. I'm just saying that I do get a sense of place there that I don't get in Palace.
Miao [to Lesley]: And in some sense, fun and decoration, which can actually motivate some ppl.
Lesley [to Miao]: How does that help the visually impaired?
Lesley [to Miao]: As I said, the reason we use graphics is to add to the learning activity or to make the learning activity in some way meaningful.
Gregor [to Lesley]: I don't think that's a valid argument. Should we get rid of audio because it doesn't help the deaf?
Miao nods agree with gregor.
Miao [to Lesley]: Well, it maynot work for *everyone, but I must say it definately works for some ppl. Same as plain text.
Lesley [to Gregor]: If you run audio and words together, there's no problem.
Lesley says, "If you run graphics and words together, there's a problem."
Gregor [to Lesley]: So it would be good to run graphics and descriptive text together for the same reason.
Lesley says, "It's a question of using technology in an enabling way."
Lesley [to Gregor]: yes and no.
KeikoS hums
Lesley says, "There's a fair amount of evidence that if you're sighted, you don't use the descriptive text, and that if you write the descriptive text to go with graphics, then the sort of language you produce is quite different from what you would produce if you were describing with no pictures."
Lesley says, "So it rather depends on your pupose in doing it.  In other words, is it the right tool for the job?"
Gregor says, "In the Frontierra environment (the software Colega and I are working on) there's a graphical representation of the room in one corner, and moo-like descriptive text in another piece of the screen."
Gregor says, "The two complement each other. Vocabulary in the text description might be reinforced or clarified by the picture that goes along with it."
Miao nods.
Lesley [to Gregor]: How does that differ from what you can do with encore or just by linking?
Gregor says, "or an object in the picture might be identified by the text in the description."
Miao says, "May I share a webpage?"
Lesley nods.
Lesley says, "Please do."
Miao shares a URL...
  <http://achieve.utoronto.ca:2221/2146>.
KeikoS [to Miao]: if URL is short <g>
Gregor [to Lesley]: It's similar to what you could do in enCore, but at VOUSI, I see that a lot of the "rooms" have pictures but no descriptions. It's not something they've chosen to implement there.
Gregor says, "And I'd say the same about the page that Miao just shared with us...."
Miao says, "For me and the owner, I think the graphic do provide a *place like sense."
Lesley [to Gregor]: No, it's not a language learning moo.  That's what I mean by the right tools for the job.  The purpose at VOUSI is different so you wouldn't expect redundancy of the sort we're discussing here.
Miao apologizes for distracting the lince of voi, though.
Gregor says, "In Frontierra, this picture would be accompanied by text that says something like "You see a 3-story proto-victorian mansion. it is dark brown with yada yada yada etc. etc. etc.""
Lesley [to Miao]: It's very relevant, because it brings us round to the consideration of the right tools for whatever it is your purpose is.
Gregor nods at Lesley. "That makes sense."
Miao nods.
Lesley says, "I don't believe in using the technology just because I can, you know!"
KeikoS [to Gregor]: we have never had that nice feeling classroom in real life!
Gregor notes the time.
Lesley says, "There has to be a real need and a real purpose to it."
Lesley nods at Gregor.
Lesley was about to note the time herself.
Gregor [to Lesley]: Concluding statement?
Lesley [to Miao]: And the picture you introduced introduces cultural elements too.
Gregor [to Lesley]: or shall we take a couple minutes to shape what we'll discuss at the next session?
Lesley [to Gregor]: Hmm, a) that audio is good enough now to do what we've been doing.
Lesley says, "b) that students find it useful and motivating"
Lesley says, "c) that you have to use it meaningfully and purposefully"
Lesley says, "And in answer to your last question, yes."
Lesley says, "I'd suggest looking at the tutor's role, which is what we meant to talk about today but got distracted from."
Lesley winks.
Gregor says, "Let's see a show of hands... anyone coming again to the next session?"
KeikoS nods to Lesley
Enter messages that you would like to be pasted:
[Type lines of input; use `.' to end or `@abort' to abort the command.]
|----------------[Gregor slaps some spam on the screen]----------------|
NETEACH MOO Session 23-B
(Friday, Feb 9, 8 PM US EST)
(Saturday, Feb 10, 1:00 AM GMT, 9 AM Tokyo)
|---------------------[Gregor wipes off his hands]---------------------|
Miao would like to know more about group 3 in Lesley's paper in the next session.
Lesley shows her hand - despite it being VERY late
KeikoS raises her hands
Lesley [to Miao]: Remind me?
Gregor [to Lesley]: Oh yeah, the stated topic! ;o)
Colega *should* be able to make it.
Puzzled keeps his hands in his pockets. #am is just too early.
Miao can't. "I will be on the bus from Toronto to Kingston."
KeikoS [to Lesley]: Late?  Ghost time...
Puzzled says, "Ooops 3am"
Gregor [to Puzzled]: yeegads. That would be a little extreme.
Gregor says, "Well then..."

Gregor puts Transparency No.6 on the stage.

On the screen you see...
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